User avatar
leighb2282

Posted Tue Jan 16, 2018 11:30 pm

Hey folks, does anyone have an original Lemmings 2 the Tribes disk 1 that HAS the 'install to HD' executable on it?

I did not read the readme file which would have told me to COPY the file to my HD and THEN execute it, versus just clicking on it, which then tried to do an HDD install onto the floppy.... when it ran out of room it cancelled and then proceeded to delete all the files that it placed on the floppy including (you guessed it) the 'install to HD' executable as well, meaning my most recent purchase I screwed up within 5 minutes of receiving it in the mail :(

long story short: read the readme and does anyone have Lemming 2 original disks?

User avatar
Zippy Zapp
CA, USA

Posted Wed Jan 17, 2018 7:57 am

leighb2282 wrote:...when it ran out of room it cancelled and then proceeded to delete all the files that it placed on the floppy including (you guessed it) the 'install to HD' executable as well
long story short: read the readme and does anyone have Lemming 2 original disks?
Ouch. Some of the installers back then were very dumb. Not even smart enough to look to see it was installing on floppy. I don't trust them which is why, if I don't make a backup first, I at least slide the write protect in place.

When I get home I will look through my boxes of disks to see if I have it. I know I bought the original version back then but I have not seen it yet since I unloaded my stuff from storage. I *may* also have a backup of the originals but it would be direct from the originals as I usually didn't keep cracked versions if I had the originals...

Edit: I forgot to ask if you have the PAL or NTSC version, if in fact they are different, as I don't recall? If I have one it is undoubtably the NTSC version if there was a separate one.

User avatar
intric8
Seattle, WA, USA
Website

Posted Wed Jan 17, 2018 9:51 am

I believe I found a non-cracked version of Disk 1, leighb2282. I've sent you a PM.

User avatar
leighb2282

Posted Wed Jan 17, 2018 10:40 am

intric8 wrote:I believe I found a non-cracked version of Disk 1, leighb2282. I've sent you a PM.
Thanks Intric8, I'll take a look when I get home - all the ones I have tried from online sources are all missing the 'install to HD' file in the root directory of the floppy disk.

I should note I have the NTSC version on the game and while it plays fine when booting from disk i would LOVE to be able to get it installed on the HD.

User avatar
Shot97
Detroit, MI, USA
Website

Posted Wed Jan 17, 2018 11:13 am

I find it odd the game even had the write protect tab in there to be able to do such a thing... I could swear the original Lemmings came without one. Though I guess Lemmings 2 had a save feature built in... More likely terrible copy protection that wouldn't let you copy the disk without special copy programs, necessitating a need to save onto the original disks... Awful policy when you have the right to your own backup copy. Did the 2nd game also have manual lookup for copy protection as well? The first one definitely had that, but to go that route with the 2nd game while doing their best to not make the disks themselves be copied, double awful.

User avatar
Shot97
Detroit, MI, USA
Website

Posted Wed Jan 17, 2018 11:20 am

I know the first game had separate NTSC/PAL versions, but that was more because of the game bypassing AmigaDOS in favor of their own bootloader. It was made in Europe in NTSC graphics mode 320x200, so it was meant to be seen stretched into widescreen. It was no big deal to port it to NTSC because it was already made in that mode, just it would have been stretched into 4:3 over here. Maybe some minor speed fixes, as the music and game speed are the exact same in PAL and NTSC. But I think it was mostly that custom boot thing that required the separate PAL/NTSC versions. Rare occasion where an NTSC version of a game will not play on PAL machines.

If the 2nd game can be installed onto hard drive, I would guess the game is fully AmigaDOS compliant, and thus there would have been no need for separate PAL/NTSC versions if the game had been designed in 320x200 in the first place.

User avatar
leighb2282

Posted Wed Jan 17, 2018 11:27 am

They do not come with the need to look up stuff in the manual (thank goodness) BUT I tried copying the disks to make a backup of them and it just ended up with a borked 'non-copy' which Workbench did not recognize.

And yep, they did indeed have write protect tabs, aaand like an idiot I didn't make sure they were write-protected before I tried installing it, I expected the HD install to be like all the other 'install programs' which ask for the installation type first (novice, Intermediate, advanced) and then ask for a location but nope, it just goes straight to installing at the location the install executable is, without even checking to see if it is a floppy disk (or even ITS OWN INSTALL DISK)

I'm holding out that intric8's version he found is different from all the others I saw online - they all DON'T have the iHD install file I need.
Shot97 wrote:I find it odd the game even had the write protect tab in there to be able to do such a thing... I could swear the original Lemmings came without one. Though I guess Lemmings 2 had a save feature built in... More likely terrible copy protection that wouldn't let you copy the disk without special copy programs, necessitating a need to save onto the original disks... Awful policy when you have the right to your own backup copy. Did the 2nd game also have manual lookup for copy protection as well? The first one definitely had that, but to go that route with the 2nd game while doing their best to not make the disks themselves be copied, double awful.

User avatar
Shot97
Detroit, MI, USA
Website

Posted Wed Jan 17, 2018 11:33 am

Yeah, can't say the version I have has an install, because it would certainly be on my hard drive if it did! haha. Ugh... I've got a good site with many images, but I don't usually download all of them unless I'm having issues... If I get one and it works, I would assume it comes with the stuff it is supposed to come with... But not always... Hmmm... I wonder if the original PAL release indeed did not have an install program, rather than say crackers deleting it for example...

If I recall the original Lemmings had been critiqued in American magazines for not being installable, a thing Europeans did not care about because the hard drive market was so small there. That would be very interesting if someone could pinpoint a hard drive install being only for the American audience.

Also - It tended to be the American games (and software especially) that got that typical novice/expert type of install interface. That was a standard that Commodore themselves introduced for version 2.x but it also made its way back down to 1.x operating systems. Anything made before 2.1 or whatever was released wouldn't have had that interface, and many companies were late to adopting that one anyway, though again the American ones were more likely to have that interface. Wild West for the most part when it came to the interfaces for installing most games.

User avatar
leighb2282

Posted Wed Jan 17, 2018 12:47 pm

Hah your hitting the nail right on the head - the included paper documentation with the box states they went to great lengths to allow users to install to hard drive! the Lemmings 2 big-box version (NTSC) I bought was apparently some limited box set as it as the 'storybook' of all the different tribes and such which looks to only be a part of the limited edition.
Shot97 wrote:Yeah, can't say the version I have has an install, because it would certainly be on my hard drive if it did! haha. Ugh... I've got a good site with many images, but I don't usually download all of them unless I'm having issues... If I get one and it works, I would assume it comes with the stuff it is supposed to come with... But not always... Hmmm... I wonder if the original PAL release indeed did not have an install program, rather than say crackers deleting it for example...

If I recall the original Lemmings had been critiqued in American magazines for not being installable, a thing Europeans did not care about because the hard drive market was so small there. That would be very interesting if someone could pinpoint a hard drive install being only for the American audience.

Also - It tended to be the American games (and software especially) that got that typical novice/expert type of install interface. That was a standard that Commodore themselves introduced for version 2.x but it also made its way back down to 1.x operating systems. Anything made before 2.1 or whatever was released wouldn't have had that interface, and many companies were late to adopting that one anyway, though again the American ones were more likely to have that interface. Wild West for the most part when it came to the interfaces for installing most games.

User avatar
Bulletdust

Posted Fri Jan 19, 2018 4:22 pm

You can do this easily using WHDload, all the images are available online.

Image





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